[Mageia-dev] Non-free firmwares in installer

andre999 andr55 at laposte.net
Sat Mar 26 06:11:40 CET 2011

Frank Griffin a écrit :
> On 03/25/2011 12:34 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
>> My two cents as an user:
>>> Presumably, FLOSS supporters are satisfied with the state of the current
>>> ISOs, and https://bugs.mageia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=523 would address
>>> extending install functionality without changing the content of the
>>> existing ISOs, which should be an improvement over where we are now
>>> without corrupting the FLOSS purity of the existing ISOs.
>> Not all "FLOSS supporters" believe that ISOs should be "pure".
>> I would label myself a FLOSS partisan (having contributed in FLOSS
>> projects for 10 years), and yet I don't really make a fuss if an
>> ISO contains non-free software, especially if such software is
>> necessary for good use of some peripherals...
> Neither do I.
>> By labelling "FLOSS supporters" only the partisans of aforementioned
>> "purity" (a term which, in any political context, should really give you
>> shivers), you are making the community as a whole a disservice. It is
>> not "the purists" vs. "the realists", or some other caricatural
>> reduction of reality.
> The labeling was for typographical convenience, simply a way to
> differentiate one camp in this discussion from the other, and was pretty
> obviously not a part of the intrinsic arguments.
> I'm on neither side in this; my interest is in having the install
> support wireless networking, which has nothing to do with whether there
> is one ISO or two. All the necessary files are already in the distro, I
> just want the install to use them if they're available. That is not a
> FLOSS/non-FLOSS/sorta-FLOSS issue. I install cooker/cauldron only, and I
> haven't installed from an ISO since I got involved with cooker except as
> an occasional test.
> I don't care how many ISOs there are, or whether the installer gets
> these files from the moon. I just figure I have a better chance of
> seeing this implemented if I point out that two ISOs steps on as few
> toes as possible, given the current contents of the DVDs. If you want to
> take up cudgels about merging them for an additional 1% or so of user
> experience, be my guest.

 From what you say, there are not a lot of points of disagreement 
between us, on this issue.
We both have contributed to open source for a long time, you apparently 
mostly on developement/packaging, myself mostly translating/ aide in 
forums, with some contributions to development.  (Currently an 
apprentice packager.)

You find 2 isos a minor inconvenience, but in practice normally install 
online, from cooker/cauldron.

Myself, I find a single DVD that contains everything I need to get a 
fully working system (in terms of hardware/drivers) a major convenience, 
and do not have the luxury of the bandwidth necessary to install from 
the internet.
I don't know if you have ever installed from Mandriva's 3-cd set, but 
juggling 3 cds on installing a package is a hassle that I very much 
prefer to avoid.  One iso is great.

As well, I appreciate very much the ability to do a complete, fully 
working reinstall without internet access.
(To facilitate this, I keep packages installed from sources other than 
the DVD in a separate partition.)

The single DVD is not only useful for myself.  It is handy to promote 
Linux as well.  Unfortunately, with missing firmware and drivers, the 
DVD will not fully work on many systems.  And new users prefer a 
_single_ iso that just works.  Having to juggle isos is a deterant.

On the question of space on the DVD, you must admit that all the 
(non-free) firmware and drivers (not already included) would not take an 
enormous amount of space.
Note that on the Mandriva 2010.2 DVD, for example, the 2 biggest games 
take about 100 M and 40 M repectively.
It is simply a matter of priorities.

In sum, it is easy to understand your point of view, as you don't 
(normally) use isos.
Please understand the point of view of those who do, particularly those 
who have serious bandwidth restrictions.

There are others who militate for a "free-only" DVD, but seem to be 
unaware that no distro contains only "free" software, not even Fedora.
Just as no distro runs on "free/non-proprietary" hardware.


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